Episode 122: On Ryan Russell's coming out, the divine US Open, and interview w/ Jessica Berman

On this week’s show, everybody's on the pod and super excited about BIAD Live in Nashville Monday, September 9th for the Amend Together conference. [4:29]

Then we shift gears to consider the significance of NFL free agent Ryan Russell's beautifully penned announcement that he is bisexual. [14:00] Then Jessica chats with the National Lacrosse League's Deputy Commissioner about her new position. [27:18]. Finally, Shireen leads the group in Brenda's favorite game of "What are you watching?" Co-hosts chat about the wonderful U.S. Open, Champion's League draw, and Copa Libertadores. [44:00]

Of course, you’ll hear the Burn Pile, [58:55] our Bad Ass Woman of the Week [1:00:53] and what is good in our worlds.

Links

Ryan Russell’s essay: https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27484719/no-distractions-nfl-veteran-opens-sexuality

NFL Player Comes Out As Bisexual Man in Heartfelt Essay: https://www.out.com/sports/2019/8/29/nfl-player-comes-out-bisexual-man-heartfelt-essay

Larry Johnson’s conspiracy theories… https://twitter.com/2LarryJohnson7/status/1167133126533013506

How homophobia in football became a major theme of the new season in France: https://farenet.org/news/how-homophobia-in-football-became-a-major-theme-of-the-new-season-in-france/

NORTH AMERICA’S ELITE WOMEN HOCKEY PLAYERS ANNOUNCE, “DREAM GAP TOUR,” A SERIES OF SHOWCASE EVENTS PLAYED WITH THE MISSION OF CLOSING THE GAP BETWEEN WHAT BOYS AND GIRLS CAN ASPIRE TO ACHIEVE: http://pwhpa.com/dream-gap-tour-announcement/

Lucy Bronze: humble, relentless and now the best player in Europe: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/aug/30/lucy-bronze-uefa-player-of-the-year-award-europe?CMP=share_btn_tw

Juniper Eastwood is the first out Division I transgender cross-country runner: https://www.outsports.com/2019/8/30/20834159/juniper-eastwood-transgender-runner-division-i-cross-country-track-and-field-university-of-montana

Para-badminton world champion Manasi Joshi focusing on mixed doubles for 2020 Paralympics: https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/sport-others/para-badminton-world-champion-manasi-joshi-focusing-on-mixed-doubles-for-2020-paralympics/

Edmonton paddlers break records, capture 85 medals at Dragon Boat World Championships: https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/edmonton-paddlers-break-records-capture-85-medals-at-dragon-boat-world-championships

Transcript

Shireen: Dear Flamethrowers, it's Shireen. I would like to take a minute to dedicate episode 122 to Sharon Elizabeth Tomlinson, née Bigelow. She is the mother of a Flamethrower and a very dear friend, Melissa Doldron. Sharon passed away on August 31st, 2019. Sharon, your support of your community, helping to inspire and support incredible human beings and your love of the Toronto Blue Jays are just a few of the many reasons you will be so missed. Rest in power.

Brenda: Welcome, to this week's episode of Burn It All Down. It's the feminist sports podcast you need. Today the gang is all here. I'm Brenda Elsey, Associate Professor of History at Hofstra University and I'm joined by Shireen Ahmed, Freelance Writer and Sports Activist in Toronto, Canada and ideologue of the toxic femininity charge.

The brilliant Dr. Amira Rose Davis, Assistant Professor of History and African American Studies at Penn State University. Jessica Luther, baker, PhD-er and author of Unsportsmanlike Conduct College Football and the Politics of Rape. She's in Austin, Texas and the unsinkable, whip-smart Lindsay Gibbs, sports reporter at ThinkProgress in DC.

Before we start, I'd like to thank our patrons for their generous support and just to remind all of you that you can be a Flamethrower too in our Patreon Campaign. You pledge a certain amount monthly to become an official Patron of the podcast and in exchange you get access to special rewards, most recently, Amira and Jessica's amazing vlog, I guess you call them? The video vlog thing, which is amazing, but we are so grateful for your support and so happy that our flame throwing family is growing.

On this week show we're going to talk about the NFL, specifically the significance of player Ryan Russell coming out as bisexual. Jessica interviews Jessica Berman, the National Lacrosse League’s new Deputy Commissioner and Executive Vice President of Business Affairs. They talk about Berman's path to becoming the highest female executive in a men's pro sports league, being a woman in a male dominated industry, and what differentiates the National Lacrosse League from other professional leagues. 

Finally, we're going to have around of “what are you watching?” One of my favorite games on Burn It All Down. Before all that, we are going to remind our Flamethrowers about our Nashville event. Jessica, can you give us an update?

Jessica: Yeah, so we're going to be in Nashville live on Monday, September 9th at 10:00 AM at the Music City Center. It's part of the YWCA of Nashville's SHIFT conference, and then later that day, so Monday September 9th at 5:30 PM, we are going to do a meet up inside the OMNI Hotel. There's a coffee shop called Bongo Java. The address 250 5th avenue south. Again, it's at 5:30 PM, we hope to see some Flamethrowers in Nashville!

Brenda: Awesome. What are you guys most excited about? Shireen, I bet there's something you're excited about.

Shireen: I am very excited about Bongo Java's because it's one of the oldest roasters in Nashville and that's our meet up so, I take coffee very seriously, and I'm excited to meet Flamethrowers. I cannot wait to cuddle with my co-hosts, I've missed y’all so much. And I have matching surprises again for everybody. I've never been to Tennessee before, so I need a cowboy hat, I'm still working on that. Because it's not cowboy hat season in Toronto ... I don't know if it's ever cowboy hat season in Toronto so I'm-

Jessica: We were about to say-!

Shireen: ... Yes, there are seasons.

Brenda: Mid February, maybe!

Shireen: And so I'm really excited and I'm assuming it's going to be warmer because it's already cold here.

Brenda: And just to say the conference looks really interesting. I'm pretty excited to hear some of the speakers and we've got it up all over our website and we'll tweet it out again this week, so people should check it out. If you're in the Nashville area, it'd be wonderful to see you.

Okay, this week Ryan Russell and free agent in the NFL came out as bisexual and it was big news. Amira, can you lead us through a discussion here?

Amira: Yeah, sure. So Ryan Russell has been in NFL for about three years. He played college ball at Purdue. He was drafted by the Cowboys in 2015. After that, he's been a journeyman. He played for the Bucks for two years. Then as Brenda said, he's currently in search of a team now, but he penned a very moving article about his sexuality in which he talks about from very early on trying to compartmentalize and shift parts of himself, because he understood, he received the message that there was no place for any idea of softness or whatever in football.

He equated his love for poetry and reading and his bisexuality as “soft.” The thing that I really want to zone in on are some of the words that he wrote, which were really powerful, he's a wonderful writer. He said, "Growing up, I always felt as though my existence slipped between the cracks of two worlds." He talks about not identifying as straight and hyper masculine and aggressive, and feeling he had to hide that part of himself to pursue a career in the NFL. In particular, the words that really stuck out at me, he's talking about a blogger who had pieced together the fact that he was seeing this guy. 

He was in the background of an Instagram video and called him up and basically said, "Be more careful but I'll do a favor for you and I won't out you,” essentially. To this he says, "Let that sink into your brain. Even though openly LGBTQ people are thriving in every area of public life, they're so invisible in pro sports that a gossip blogger is doing a favor for a bisexual football player by not disclosing that he happens to date men. Nobody should need a favor to live honestly, and nobody's world should being careful mean not being yourself. The career you choose shouldn't dictate the parts of yourself that you embrace." And it's that last line that I really want to kick off our discussion with today.

The career you choose shouldn't dictate the parts of yourself that you embrace. I think one of the things that is all over this piece is a feeling of the boundaries of football in particular being so hardened that it requires so much repression on the part of gay and bisexual or just different men, particularly black men that he talks about here. That's where I want to start the discussion. What were your reactions to the piece?

Brenda: Jessica?

Jessica: I thought it was beautiful. I mean, like you said Amira, he's a phenomenal writer, it made me cry. I was crying at my desk as I read through it. It's wild at this point it was brave of him. I honestly don't know where his career will go from here and I honestly think he's right. This will probably jeopardize his ability to play in the NFL moving forward.

Which is a really sad testament of the NFL and that organization in general football culture in particular should be very ashamed that that is true. I worry for him, about his career, because it does sound he really wants to play football again. I don't know, it's something to me that when I think about other hyper-masculine, even violent spaces that are more…accepting?

It's been quite a while now that the US military, there's a lot going on with transgender soldiers. As far as something like don't ask, don't tell, it's been a long time since they put that to bed. The fact that we still have this one, it's probably not the only one, but as far as its importance within our culture, this one space where it is still so homophobic, that's just really sad still but I really was taken by his piece and how beautifully he wrote about his own experience and I hope that we get to see him on a football field.

Brenda: Well, and you have to wonder, just how much the popularity of the sport with certain sectors of society has to do with their feeling like that's a space that they can express homophobia in a way that they don't in others. I mean, ask myself that all the time. Its professional men sports, incredibly gender segregated. The misogyny is all wrapped up in the homophobia. And I wonder sometimes, if it became an inclusive space, would the same people love it as much?

Amira: Right, it's like that book title, The More Women Succeed, The More Men Love Football. I think you could probably amend it.

Jessica: Yes.

Brenda: Exactly!

Amira: You can completely amend it to be like the more civil liberties gay people get, the more men love football, it becomes the safe space so to speak, to turn it on its head. Bam, see what I did there?

Brenda: Lindsay.

Lindsay: Yeah, I think more than anything, football is tied to this notion of masculinity that is toxic. Some might call that toxic masculinity, if I'm being succinct with my words. But I thought it was really important that he came out as bisexual and open about bisexuality. We know that by visibility is a real ... I mean, it's a blind spot in society and especially among men. I thought that was just a really important thing to acknowledge. I think that because we are still looking for, I mean, acceptance for openly gay men in these main sports, biggest sports in the United States, football and hockey and basketball. Because of this, I think that the bisexuality part of this is going to get lost in the conversation.

So I just want to make sure that we hold that importance about who he is. I think that what everyone is saying is just spot on about the way we view masculinity and the way masculinity fuels football culture. It's not exactly the same thing by any means, but the reaction to the thought that Carli Lloyd could kick a field goal in the NFL this week, I think was another example of that.

Whereas all of a sudden you saw all of these people coming forward and saying, they were all of a sudden very concerned about the safety of football players when a woman was involved. They were all of a sudden very concerned about the safety of women when it involved a football field.

It was just a staggering thing and I think it was a few people, this is not a unique point to me, but it really brought home the fact that it was the fact that if a woman could do this, if a woman could succeed in their space, it would so upend their notion of what football is that it was too terrifying to even be able to comprehend. That's where all of this anger and all this dismissiveness came from. I think that you can relate that a lot to also allowing this to be a space where bisexual and gay men can succeed.

Brenda: Shireen.

Shireen: Yeah, I absolutely thought the piece was beautifully written. He talked about himself, he offered so much about himself, including loving Hemingway. It was really, really beautifully done and he taught as he ... like I learned a lot generally and about him when he shared one of the things that was notable was that he had already framed it about how he feels about the response and I could relate to that as somebody who writes something anticipating what the reaction will be.

He said one of the things that really, really stuck with me was, "If you don't know me personally, I don't take what you have to say personally." Because he's already anticipating backlash and that made me sad at the same time because we know that's coming. We know the reactions, the dismissal, ignoring, maybe not picking him up for a team. And I really hope he plays like I don't watch NFL but I will if he plays. There's reasons or specific people around whom I'll support it and watch it and cheer for them.  He's definitely one of them and I wish him above all safety and peace moving forward, and he just seems to have come to a place of relief, which is quite often what we hear from people when they come out. It can be their experience. I'm rooting for him and I hope that he goes somewhere that fosters and encourages his growth because just what a beautiful, beautiful young man.

Brenda: Next up, Jessica Interviews Jessica Berman, the National Lacrosse Leagues new Deputy Commissioner and Executive Vice President of Business Affairs.

Jessica: Hello Flamethrowers. Jessica here and I'm joined today by another Jessica, Jessica Berman. Earlier this week the National Lacrosse League announced that Berman will be their new Deputy Commissioner and Executive Vice President of Business Affairs. She's leaving the National Hockey League where she's been for the last 13 years to take this position with the NLL. With this new position, Berman becomes the first woman to hold the title of Deputy Commissioner at any professional sports league in North America. She starts her new job on September 9th. Welcome to Burn It All Down, Jessica.

Jessica Berman: Thanks for having me, Jessica!

Jessica: I would like to start at your beginning. How did you get into sports administration and what about it appealed to you?

Jessica Berman: I decided I wanted to work in sports from the time I was in high school. I grew up what I would consider being as an athlete, as a dancer and worked with the teams in my high school including as a manager of the team and attended a lot of games as a fan and really fell in love with the concept that sports is one of the few social contracts that really bring people together from different backgrounds. I decided in that moment that I wanted to work for my career in professional sports. Because I was really inspired by what I observed as a fan and working closely with the teams in my high school.

Jessica: How did you get into sports administration?

Jessica Berman: I went to the University of Michigan, which of course is known for its athletics and its athletic department and sought out internships being a manager for the Michigan hockey team, Michigan football team and Michigan baseball team. My role working for those teams was really to work with the players and to prepare them for interviews and media, to do game notes and keep statistics and really anything that the coaches or management at the university needed to help the teams to promote the game and the players. I began to seek out internships in the sport and worked in sports journalism, sports broadcasting, did some color commentating.

Jessica: Wow.

Jessica Berman: And writing for newspapers. I really tried out all different aspects of the industry including working for a sports agent during college and really by process of elimination decided that I wanted to go to law school and work on management side in labor relations. I went to Fordham Law School and joined Proskauer Rose, where I have the good fortune of representing and working with all of the professional leagues to retain Proskauer Rose’s outside council and worked closely on collective bargaining and all of the labor relations matters that the leagues were dealing with.

Jessica: Wow, that's fascinating. I wanted to ask about being a woman and an executive in men’s sports. What is your experience been like as a woman in this position?

Jessica Berman: For the most part, I have come across men who have been supportive of me and my career and really from day one, I come from a background of professionals in my family who really take work really seriously. Both my parents are still working at ages 82 and 72 full time-

Jessica: Wow!

Jessica Berman: And I was indoctrinated in me really early that you have to always put your best foot forward and you'll always hopefully be judged on your work product. I think it's been the rare exception that I haven't experience that and really been fortunate to I think grow up in a generation where there's a pivot happening in terms of women really getting opportunities and being celebrated for not just having the position but being able to contribute a diverse perspective.

Because that timing has worked out, I've been able to really capitalize on that for my career benefit and all of the hard work that I've done has really been able to come to fruition. I won't say it's been 100% positive, of course there's been some bad apples along the way, but I really work hard to try to focus on the positive and the people who are supportive. There's been so many mentors that I've had, men in particular who have taken me under their wing and said, "Let me be there to support you. What can I do to help?" I feel really fortunate that I've gotten to this point in my career to have this opportunity.

Jessica: Yeah. I was going to actually ask about mentors and whether or not you had any women that are mentors to you.

Jessica Berman: Yeah, I've had women who have been mentors of mine along the way. A couple of people come to mind, one partner at Proskauer whose name is Kathleen McKenna, who really looked out for me as a woman. I remember when I came to her and said that I was leaving Proskauer and ultimately joining the NHL. Of course, she understood my aspirations to work in sports. She was supportive but really wanted me to be part of the next generation of lawyers who were breaking the glass ceilings for women partners at law firms, which is another industry that women are really underrepresented.

Here at the NHL, I feel really fortunate to work for Kim Davis, who is a pioneer in diversity inclusion and building communities through brand. Similarly, when I came to her and told her that I was leaving, I think her quote was, "Crying as your manager, but cheering as your mentor." Certainly I had the opportunity to work for women, work with women who have been supportive, been my champions, but actually my mom is probably my best role model as a woman.

She works full time at 72 and I think struck the right balance between making sure that she was always owning her feminism and her role as a woman and prioritizing being a mom and her role in our family, but found the time even if it was at odd hours of the night or morning or on weekends or on vacation to get her work done. I've just done my best to try to continue that legacy.

Jessica: That's lovely. I want to ask about lacrosse obviously because that's where you're headed. How much did you know about the National Lacrosse League before becoming interested in the position? Are you learning about lacrosse at the same time that you're learning about the NLL or is this something that you already knew about?

Jessica Berman: Because in the last four years my role at the NHL has changed and I went from being a lawyer and deputy general counsel to focusing on the next generation of fans, and cause, and youth sports, in that capacity in the last four years I've really been interested in lacrosse for as more from the perspective of understanding why it is one of the few team sports that has debunked the trend of decline in youth sports participation in the US.

I've observed it really as an outsider because a lot of the initiatives that I've been working on have been focused on growing the game of hockey at the youth level and creating an emotional connection to our game in hockey and observing the movement and the traction that lacrosse has received from communities across North America.

I would say that's the level of familiarity that I've had with the sport itself. When Nick, the Commissioner of the National Lacrosse League and I were introduced, I had a pretty, I would say, superficial level of understanding of lacrosse. But I'm going all in this year, so I'm going to have a steep learning curve and hope to be immersed very soon.

Jessica: I feel probably a lot of people listening maybe have never even heard of the National Lacrosse League. I know that there are other professional lacrosse leagues like Major League Lacrosse and Premier Lacrosse League, but in NLL is different than those two. Correct? Can you explain what the NLL is?

Jessica Berman: Yeah, sure. So I would say there's a couple of differentiators. Probably the biggest differentiator is that the National Lacrosse League has been around for 33 years. There's a long history that exists with this league. Second is that the National Lacrosse League is the only league that plays professionally in the winter months. The NLL is an indoor league and plays mostly in NHL arenas where it's an enclosed environment and the game is slightly different in terms of the rules, and the number of players that play and all those sorts of things.

But essentially I think playing in the winter months as opposed to in the summer months and that they play indoors versus outdoors are other really important differentiators. When I was doing my research on this league and the flurry of activity that exists today with lacrosse, that all of this extra attention on the sport itself from a professional perspective is a good thing for all of us right now. Because it demonstrates the fact that the sport has interest and room to grow and that there's a marketplace for it. I suspect that the NLL which will open its season in December will pick up some of the lift from this summer where the MLL and the PLL have been playing outdoors these past couple of months.

Jessica: Are there players who do both indoor and outdoor?

Jessica Berman: There are.

Jessica: Okay, that's interesting. I didn't even realize until I was doing my research to interview you that there was indoor lacrosse. What is your position going to be as Deputy Commissioner and Executive Vice President of Business Affairs? What will your job entail?

Jessica Berman: Number one, I'll be supporting Nick and everything that he's focused on from a growth perspective. Some of his key areas of focus are expansion and expanding the footprint of the league across North America. We have two new teams coming into the league this coming season for the 19-20 season up from 11-13, and I know that he's really focused on identifying new markets and new owners, so that's one area of focus.

Another area of focus for sure will be from a media perspective and we'll be continuing to build our relationship with Turner and B/R Live and so we'll build on that foundation to grow the visibility of the game. I think two areas that in my background that are unique are my experience in labor relations of course. I'll get to know our players’ association better, and understanding how we can find commonalities and compromise for sure each of our interests as we begin to lay the foundation and the framework for our relationship moving forward.

Then the second area is really for the last four years I've been working so closely with all of our teams in the NHL on sharing best practices. I expect that we'll be looking at how the League communicates with its team to ensure that they're getting the benefit of each other's strengths and working to really leverage that experience to enhance how each of the teams operate.

Jessica: Well, can you just as a final thing, you have mentioned the growth in lacrosse that it's going up instead of declining and on the youth level. Do you know why?

Jessica Berman: Well, I think there's a couple of reasons that are speculated. I'm not sure that any of this is based in hard data or research, but from what I've been told, because actually hockey is another sport that's been growing in recent years. I think there's an interest the fast pace of the game. I think that the physicality and the pace of the game seems to jive with Gen Z and the way that they consume and engage in activities.

I think sports like lacrosse and hockey are seeing some of the benefits from that. I know for my kids they want to go, you know? They spend so many hours a day sitting and playing video games that when they are doing their sports they have a lot of pent up energy. I think for a sport that's fun and fast paced and physical, makes them more inclined and interested in continuing to play.

Jessica: Well, thank you so much for joining us on Burn It All Down, Jessica Berman. Good luck in your new position with the National Lacrosse League.

Jessica Berman: Thank you so much. I really appreciate you having me.

Brenda: For the final segment of the show. I wanted to play my favorite game, “what are you watching,” on Burn It All Down. Because sometimes I feel I get into my own sports groove and I'll be following tweets and different things, but I'm not really up on what everybody is doing. Shireen, can you start us off as MC of the game?

Shireen: Sure. Welcome to What Are You Watching? I wanted to just start with the really profound quote from someone I look to as a thinker and a changemaker. She says, “I'm not a big sports fan, but I love it when they slam dunk. That is sexy.” and this is from Emma Bunton of the Spice Girls. The reason I start with this quote is just to say that sports is for all of us.

It's a birthright, how you want to consume it and some are into the US Open, which is riveting and we'll get into that. I was watching the Champs League draw. They also announced the UEFA winners. I know there's other things happening. I've been intrigued by Rayssa Leal who was an 11 year old Brazilian skateboarder who was participating in the Extreme Games in Norway. There's a lot of things, and it could be local, there's a softball team called Sisterhood Softball who was raising money to raise water wells with a Muslim charity.

There's just so much beautiful sports happening. So I will actually begin the game if that's okay. We make up the rules, so that's fine, and I will say, I was watching Reshmin Chowdhury on the Champs League draw in a room, otherwise completely filled by white men. To see this absolutely beautiful polyglot up there, brown women nailing it, interviewing.

I thought she could have given Ronaldo a lot more shade, but I guess she has to be professional, whatever that means. But I enjoyed that and it was fun, it's not the most riveting television but that's what I've been kind of into these days and I'm just really excited about sport and the fall brings the promise of it, so we can start there I guess.

Brenda: Yeah, that's a really good start. Jessica, what are you watching? I bet I can guess, but tell us.

Jessica: Yeah, well, I would hope so, it's the only thing I'm watching. I've been watching the US Open and it's been great. It's been a great Grand Slam. You can't always say that and so this one has been very fun. I was very happy to see Gael Monfils making into week two. He had to go five sets, but he still did it and I just love seeing him. Then I am enjoying this Russian named Medvedev who is number five.

He's become this evil heel of the tournament. He's been a real jerk and he flipped off the chair and part of the other night and then the crowd started booing him and then he thanked the crowd for booing him, that they inspired him, and I don't know. I love heels in sports but then of course it's all about the women. The women side of this tournament has been amazing.

Last night, we’re recording Sunday morning, last night was the Osaka, Naomi Osaka, Coco Gauff match, which Naomi handled. She handily won that but there was that beautiful moment afterwards that I didn't actually watch live, I had turned it off before then. Just a beautiful moment between these two young women of color on the biggest stage in the sport. I did want to mention, so we're moving into the round of 16 by the time you guys hear this, they will have played on Monday. There's a lot of seeded match-ups. Everyone is seeded going into the round of 16, except for two people and I just wanted to mention them. They're both American, Taylor Townsend.

Amira: Woo Taylor!!

Jessica: I love Taylor Townsend, she's going to play Bianca Andreescu, next it's Andreescu US Open debut, but this is Taylor Townsend's second week in a major in singles ever. She made the round of 32 back in 2014 at Roland Garros. But she was the top junior in the world in 2012 when the US TA shat all over her for ... They pulled her funding citing that she was too fat basically. She really went through a lot of shit, her coach a couple of years ago told the New York Times that she was broken in every way and she has just struggled a lot, but she has been a spectacular in this tournament.

She has made the second week, she beat Halep by coming to the net 106 times. I can't express enough how weird that is in tennis. She came to the net 106 times in that match, 64 times in the third set alone and she cried on court afterwards, talking about what a big deal this was to her. And so it's very exciting to see her. The other person that's unseated in the round of 16 is Kristie Ahn, who's actually from Flushing Meadows where the tournament is.

She's 27, these three wins that she's had at the US Open are her first and only Grand Slam wins in her entire career. She qualified for the 2008 US Open when she was 16 but then her parents really pushed her to get an education, so she left the tour and went to Stanford and studied science and came back in 2014 after graduating to play tennis.

Her parents made her a deal where they'd pay for three years and then they'd stop if she couldn't make it on her own. Then she had to stop playing tennis. She's come close to retiring but now she's in the round of 16 at the US Open, which will pay her bills for quite a while. It's those two and then I could keep going, but I'm just very excited about the second week and the tournament on the women's side.

Brenda: Okay Lindsay, you're up.

Lindsay: Yes, I agree with all of that. I second that, I just saw the Osaka-Gauff moment after the match where Coco Gauff is crying and Naomi Osaka has the presence of mind to say, "Join me for this post-match interview."  And Coco doesn't want to do it because she knows she'll cry and Naomi knows that ... Naomi is just 21 but has been in enough of these moments that she knows that it's okay if Coco cries.

That the crowd needs to see her and that she needs to be able to experience the crowd's love for her in that moment. For me after the match, Naomi was talking about how so many people don't see, they don't go to read the transcripts from the post-match press conferences. They don't read the articles that come out afterwards.

Naomi just had this awareness that Coco needed to be able to have that moment with the crowd because that wouldn't be replicated in any other setting. Coco really didn't want to at the time, she didn't want to speak and she didn't want people to hear her crying but I just thought it was just so beautiful of Naomi Osaka to have that awareness already. Coco has been on Instagram and saying, "Thank you for this moment, it is a moment that I will never ever forget and always treasure."

Already Coco is realizing, I think, that Naomi was right, that as much as we look at on the court stuff and say, this is part of the Williams sisters’ legacy, I think that that off-court moment of support is also a part of the Williams sisters’ legacy. We need to lift that up as well because I don't think they get enough credit for that. I've also been watching a lot of WNBA, which I know will not surprise anyone. There was another great moment just on Saturday night, which once again is the night before we’re recording this, the Las Vegas Aces and the Los Angeles Sparks were playing, and Kelsey Plum, who was the number one overall pick in the 2018 draft or 2017 draft, I think, struggled a little bit in the past few years. 

She went off for 20 points in the fourth quarter and the Aces came from behind to get this really important win, and she was crying in the post-match interview on court and A’ja Wilson, her teammate was comforting her and just so excited for her to have this moment. It was just another moment where it was just women cheering on women and their accomplishments, you know? And I know it's a little bit different in a team sport, that's a little bit more expected, but it was still just beautiful.

I think it's just so easy for us to forget how hard these players work, how hard, even though we haven't been seeing Taylor Townsend, how hard she's been working behind the scenes. Even though Kelsey Plum hasn't been making the shots, that doesn't mean she hasn't been putting in the work every day and feeling that pressure because the expectation was that Kelsey Plum would have these games on a daily basis.

The expectation was that Taylor Townsend would be in the second week of the US open on a regular basis. So I think that those two moments, both of those interviews and they happened within a few hours ago, are going to really stick with me for a long time.

Brenda: Women's sports aren't just more better, as Jen Doyle always says. Jennifer Doyle, a friend of the show always says, "Women sports are more," and it does feel like that lately. Amira what's you've been watching?

Amira: Yeah, I want to go back to the US Open. I am so moved by watching these Black women on the court on the weekend that they finally unveiled the statue of Althea Gibson. I barely have words to talk about how moving it is for me.

So many people who randomly read the US Open texted me pictures of this statue of Althea Gibson. So for folks who don't know, Althea Gibson is a barrier breaker in tennis. She played at FAMU and the ATA, which was the segregated tennis clubs that Black people started when people were not letting them into the segregated white clubs.

So the ATA was really the spot where a lot of Black people got their start in tennis. And Gibson was a ATA phenomenon, and then at the age of 23 she got pulled up to the US Nationals, and in the 50s, she really started to shine. She won 11 majors, and she was the first Black player to win the French Open, Wimbledon, and the US Nationals.

Then not many people know, she actually, after she retired from tennis and went on to compete on the circuit in golf, and she was the original two sport athlete, if you will.

So while players that you see this weekend compete on Arthur Ashe, there actually isn't an equivalent court dedication to Althea Gibson. The reasons are certainly gendered, and so this statue of Althea Gibson is certainly long overdue. If you want to know more about this particular relationship, we did a documentary, I was in a documentary about it on CBS Sport Network about Arthur and Althea.

But in particular, and perhaps in the words of Taylor Townsend who said, "Yeah, the Williams sisters are certainly pioneers, but I was wearing an Althea Gibson shirt this week and she was the OG” and for that to be true and for the statute to be unveiled this weekend and to see Coco and Naomi, and to see Naomi say, "We both made it."

One of the hidden languages that she's speaking there is they both it in this lily white ass game. And when she spoke to her parents about that behind the scenes, I really felt that. When Taylor turns to her box and said, "Let's eat," after winning her match, I really felt that. I think that there's just this, it's ... I am so glad to be watching this particular tournament right now with these women.

So that's mainly what I'm watching, but also college sports, I've started and I've been supporting my students who have been going a lot of Penn State games. I actually went to my first Penn State football game yesterday. It was a lot, but also really infectious. The energy was really interesting. And I had seen women's soccer and women's volleyball that same night, and I have to say the crowds and the energy at all of these spaces are just really captivating and that's something that was unexpected.

As much as we just talked and just talked in the last segment about how toxic and masculine and boarded up football is, my experience at Beaver Field was actually really, I don't know even the word for it. I was unexpectedly brought into something that felt very communal, and I was sickened by the fact that 104,000 people were watching my students play. The farce of it, it was really laid bare, these are athletes, they're not in school to learn.

But at the same time, that same energy being then gone to the women's sports and when women's basketball’s new coach put up their video on the board and everybody went and crazy like that, those moments were really significant. So I'm excited for college sports this year as well.

Brenda: Okay, great. That's, super awesome. Interesting. Okay, now there's me, so I'm watching something that I bet that none of my co-hosts are watching, which is the Copa Libertadores, which is the South American club championship and the quarter finals just finished up. It's a long haul of a club soccer tournament, and basically what that means is that there's 38 clubs that compete over a six to eight month period.

There's like first stage, second stage, knock out stage. What that means is it's like if you took whoever wins the Super Bowl in the US and then they played whoever won the Super Bowl in the rest of the region, like who plays in Mexico and who plays in Canada.

So it's actually, sorry to say, but way cooler than just a national sport in my opinion because it's like watching your team, like let's say it was Amira watching the Patriots playing whatever equivalent that is in another country, and it's really awesome and there's two legs so you play— because the fans make such a difference in the opinion of the players in the game, because they're so passionate and they're so all over it, they have to have two legs. So one at one's home stadium and the other at the other club's home stadium.

Anyway, it was really exciting this quarter finals and it's really exciting to see South American soccer. If you wonder to yourself why there are 800 Brazilians that are exported to every year to play across the world, there's a reason. It's not just like they're born like that and it's not because soccer is something that's cool for poor people and so poor countries do it, it's because they're freaking amazing and the fans demand it.

They demand a different kind of play, and there is that back and forth relationship between the fans and the players, and it's so exciting. So now the quarter finals are over, meaning the semifinals are going to take place on October 1st. Not surprisingly, two teams from Argentina and two teams from Brazil, that's often the way it shakes down.

So on October 1st we have Boca Juniors and River playing, they're super classic, amazing. You can’t even believe it. I know, but it's like of course we do. Because it's just got to stay lit. Then Flamengo and Grêmio, there was a big surprise, for me, when Grêmio beat Palmeiras, which is a traditional favorite. So it was really nice to see someone new, though it would have been great to have the Quito team, LDU Quito who made it to the quarter finals from Ecuador but did not squeak by.

Anyway, the skill, the intensity of fan following, if you've watched the commercialized European football, they're trying to remake South American football that way. Watch it before it ends up like the Premier League. Seriously I mean, not that there's nothing good about the Premier League, but watch it before it gets quite so commercialized, in any case. Shireen, you want to end the game? Close out the game?

Shireen: I'm just going to announce the winner, and the winner is all of us, Yes.

Brenda: Yay!

Shireen: We all win from this. I love sports, I love hearing you all talk about sports and what it brings to your life and it's just, it enriches and inspires and can connect in magnificent ways. Pay the athletes specially, that's one thing I'm getting but I just really, really love hearing about it and again, we are all winners.

Brenda: Now it's time to take all the things in sports that have made us angry and metaphorically put them on a giant bonfire called the Burn Pile. Jessica, can you start us off?

Jessica: Yeah, of course. So I know that the NCAA is easy to pick on but it's its own damn fault. So earlier this week, the NCAA denied Brock Hoffman's appeal to waive having to sit out a year after transferring between football programs. He was playing for Coastal Carolina when he decided to transfer to Virginia Tech because Tech is much closer to his home. His mother had a non-cancerous brain tumor removed and he wanted to be able to travel home more easily from school.

The NCAA denied his waiver in April and he appealed. According to the Roanoke Times, "The Hoffman family was asked to provide more documentation about Stephanie, his mother's illness and living situation. One of the factors that NCAA cited in the spring for denying the claim was that Stephanie's condition was improving."

The reasoning stunned Hoffman's family since they had provided documentation that she was still suffering from facial paralysis, hearing loss, and impaired eyesight. According to the times his mother got letters from four different doctors and gave them to the NCAA. The NCAA responded by, and I'm not lying here asking why, if things were difficult for her, didn't she retire from her teaching job? Hoffman's father told the times, "We have almost a million dollars of medical bills. She's a teacher and doesn't have enough years to get full pay from her pension. We simply couldn't afford it."

His family then turned over financial statements and the NCAA, documents from their insurance company to the NCAA and still their appeal was denied. Hoffman can't play football again until the 2020 season.

This is all so cold and heartless and that's not surprising coming from the NCAA, which looks at student athletes simultaneously as children to be parented and also as cash cows. Hoffman’s mom can't retire because she can't afford it. While her son plays for a big money team under the umbrella of an organization raking it in on the backs of these players.

On top of that, the NCAA makes it really hard to transfer schools without significant punishment to students. In fact, over the summer, and part of the reason the NCAA denied Hoffman’s appeal is that the NCAA implemented a stricter standard for transferring if your family member is ill. An illness in the family, "Must occur within or immediately after the academic year." Long-term consequences or long-term healing be damned, the NCAA does not care. We wish the Hoffman family well, the NCAA though we're throwing on the burn pile. Burn.

Group: Burn.

Brenda: Amira.

Amira: This week I had no shortage of things to burn. So one, à propos the earlier conversation about Ryan Russell, Larry Johnson took to Twitter with his stupid thoughts to rail against the, "effeminate agenda going on amongst the NBA and NFL elite." In which he ascertains that there are high ranking masons and handlers trying to “indoctrinate the heterosexual sports world” to go after the buying power of the LGBTQ community - which he gets right. Like he's up on the acronyms, is my point.

The NBA, it's interesting because he is this Black conspiracy theorist where like hits points that are completely assailable but then goes left. So for instance, the NBA is getting soft because everyone's a three point shooter and they have a Vogue fashion show now walking to the locker room. In the NFL, obviously Michael Sam was planned, I don't know by who, but planned by the masons apparently. And then that commercial of the people who retired and started their cupcake business, he’s not happy about that.

Then he says October is LGBTQ history month and they wear pink that month. “They want you to think it's breast cancer, but they show you that they don't care much about women. Look at the treatment of domestic violence issues” and this is where I'm like, YES, but also not your conclusion!

So anyways, I really did want to burn that and I also really wanted to freaking burn the Howard-Maryland game that was 79-0 and really revealed this is what happens when you pay, Howard made $300,000 off of taking that beat down, which is great for school officials who pad their pockets with it. But I really don't think it's worth the humiliation of the boys on the field.

But really, both of those things are worthy of burning. But can I tell you what's actually making me mad right now, is that LeBron James took out a freaking trademark on Taco Tuesday!

Brenda: What?

Jessica: Burn!

Amira: He took out a trademark on Taco Tuesday-

Brenda: He can't do that. 

Amira: ... Like he invented the mother fucking phrase, and if you look at the trademark filing, it's so that they can have a Taco Tuesday podcast, because what we need is more men talking on podcasts! That's what I want to burn, quite honestly, just burn it all down.

Brenda: And appropriating Mexican food.

Amira: Yes, burn it! Burn it!

Group: Burn.

Brenda: It's already on fire, yeah. All right, Lindsay.

Lindsay: All right, since Amira got two, I just want to add that, or three or whatever, I need to add that after that 79 to nothing beat down, Sports Illustrated tweeted that, they said Maryland beat Howard 79 to nothing and 79 was the number that Jordan McNair wore and he died last year. Jordan McNair is a football player from Maryland that only died because of the incompetence of Maryland football coaches and trainers for not recognizing heat stroke. That's not a sentimental moment!

Amira: Right, like what even is that? Like it makes no sense!

Lindsay: Like people actually killed him! Like he didn't die from cancer or something off the football field, he died from football! So football doesn't get to be the tribute for him.

Okay, my actual burn is Michigan State, because it's been a while. So late on Monday night, Michigan State's lawyers filed a 100 page motion accompanied by 900 pages of exhibits seeking to dismiss 37 lawsuits representing more than 100 Nassar survivors. The Detroit Free Press reported this.

The motion argued that while Nassar deserves to be punished for his crimes, Michigan State is not in any way liable. The quote is "Although Nassar's actions were repugnant and merit the heavy criminal penalties imposed upon him, the law does not support plaintiff's attempts to hold MSU defendants liable for its wrongs."

This all happened this in the same two weeks that we found out that one of the Nassar enablers is still on the Michigan State payroll. He was told about Nassar's abuse and did not report it. He is a trainer for the football team and he actually is facing sexual assault and domestic violence charges of his own, but he is still on paid leave, so still getting that paycheck. This also came the same time, the same week that Tom Izzo showed up at a sexual assault trial of a former basketball player who was being accused of sexual assault.

So this is the first time that Tom Izzo has made it to a courtroom to support anybody, and it was somebody being accused of sexual assault. He was acquitted, but there's a very graphic video that is disturbing.

But also this week a lawsuit got to go forward for a woman who is suing Michigan State for not taking seriously her claims that basketball players had assaulted her, and the judge dismissed Michigan State's motion to dismiss, and so that case can go forward because the judge is saying there's a lot of evidence that supports the fact that it's plausible Michigan State treated sexual assault by athletes very, very differently than it did in other instances.

So Michigan State, we haven't talked about you for a while, but we needed to bring you back onto the burn pile. Burn.

Group: Burn.

Brenda: Shireen.

Shireen: I do want to thank Lindsay for offering me this burn, and this is super bizarre, but also ironic in a way. Virginia Flames football, and they're already setting themselves up to be burned actually by calling themselves the Flames; Hugh Freeze is the new coach, he's the former coach of Ole Miss. He was debuting his coaching career with Liberty from a hospital bed. He was hospitalized for a herniated disk, but decided that that clipboard and that power was too much for him to let go of to one of the many other staff members.

So he was going to coach from a hospital bed. We understand the willingness to be with your team, but when you're lying in a hospital bed immovable, I think people will understand that maybe you should pass the mic, pass the clipboard just for that. They ended up losing to Syracuse Orange, 24-0. I just think this idea of holding so tightly to this kind of power is dangerous, it's weird and it's not necessary like-

Brenda: It's so weird!

Shireen: ... I just, I don't understand and I don't want to understand, but I had a pretty good week and then all the dumbfounding things, I'm just baffled by this whole thing. Coaching takes a lot of emotional, psychological and physical stress. So you know what Coach Freeze, focus on your hospitalization and recovery, let those, and I say this as someone with no NCAA football coaching experience admittedly.

But I do also want to say that I'm really close to my back, and if I was hospitalized I would give that my back the attention that it needs. I also would love to have a conversation with the doctors who permitted this because I just, I don't know. Anyways, I want to burn all of that, that incessant, ridiculous desire to keep clutching—and his sideline interviews, I guess bedside lying interviews.

Lindsay: Bedside interviews!

Shireen: Even more weird for me, and I just remember being like, what is happening? So.

Brenda: And it's Liberty, it's not like it's Alabama. I'm so baffled. It's Liberty freaking University!

Lindsay: They wheeled the hospital bed into the coaches’…

Shireen: In addition, I'm not even familiar with this team. So when I Googled Liberty to find out more, it just kept giving me the WNBA, which is the only like happy side of this whole thing. But my point is I was just, I don’t, anyways…so to the coach of Virginia Flames football, metaphorically putting you, I wish you the best in your recovery, but not like this, burn it down.

Lindsay: First of all, put this in the show notes. Somebody put up a clip of what the assistant coach, who I guess was on the field doing the calls or something at the end of the game. He's like, when they're running to midfield and they usually do the coaches handshake, he points up to Hugh Freeze and Hugh Freeze waves back and somebody's put this in slow motion and put it to, Will you remember me?

Shireen: Oh, my God.

Lindsay: It is so funniest thing I've ever seen! Oh, God.

Brenda: Okay. Can I get a burn?

Group: Burn

Brenda: All right, whew. Mine is less comical so I almost feel bad going last and bringing the entire mood down because I'm going to burn the racism that is so generalized in global football. And so it's just a scourge on the game. And this week it's Walter Centeno. You are on my burn pile, and just barely metaphorically a coach for Saprissa who racially abused player. Jossimar Pemberton, a player for Limón FC.

These are both in Costa Rica, and basically what kills me is the response and the propensity to say that the use of the word ‘negro’ can somehow be misinterpreted by people and that it's cultural, the way it's being used, and it can even be used as a “loving” term and all of that bullshit.

All of it actually ignores what any Spanish speaker knows, what anyone who doesn't even speak Spanish and watches the video of him yelling at the player would know, it's just, it's absolutely apparent. It's the same thing we saw with Luis Suarez and the total manipulation of something that is obvious just to defend racism.

And we've seen some really great things happening with FIFA's new rules this week. Like for the first time a match in Brazil was stopped because of homophobia. That's the same general umbrella that is used for racism as well. The game in Costa Rica also should have been stopped.

We need to see all these games being stopped when there's these incidents of racism, homophobia, and gendered violence. So I want to throw on the burn pile the ways in which people try to defend their racism by manipulating basic language. Burn.

Group: Burn.

Brenda: Okay. After all that burning, it's time to celebrate some amazing accomplishments with our badass woman of the week segment. Before we do, we'd like to acknowledge two painful moments in sports this week. BIAD’s thoughts and sympathies are with the family of Luis Enrique, former coach of Barcelona, whose nine year old daughter lost her battle with cancer this week. Rest in power Xanita. We also want to offer our condolences to the family and community of racer and TV personality Jessi Combs who died while attempting to beat her own land speed record in a 52,000 horsepower jet powered car.

Combs was known as the fastest woman on four wheels after breaking the 398 miles per hour record in that same North American Eagle Supersonic Speed Challenge in 2013. So for honorable mentions this week, we have the Mexican Women's baseball team. The national team is going to the 2020 Worlds for the first time.

Lucy Bronze, UEFA player of the year, and the first offender to win this award.

Canadian paddlers, Norlina, New Bauer of the Dragon Boat Premiere Mixed and Premiere Women's teams brought home three gold medals and one bronze alongside the women's cup awarded to the top ranked team in the world. The team broke the world record in the women's 200 meter race becoming the first female team to break the 40-second mark. And can I get a drum roll please?

Or guppy sounds, okay. Juniper Eastwood is the first out cross country division one runner in the NCAA. She is a junior at the University of Montana and is starting her season. Congratulations to the very brave and very talented Juniper Eastwood.

All right. Since the world's on fire, literally and figuratively, let's talk about what's good in our week. Lindsay.

Lindsay: I mean, we're going to Nashville so that is my beacon at the end of a long, long stretch. That's all I've got. I also, okay, I need to go back and add onto my burn because I think this makes it even, or add onto something I said earlier because I think this makes it even better. It wasn't the Liberty head coach that was pointing, or Liberty assistant coach that was pointing up at Hugh Freeze in the hospital bed, it was a Syracuse coach. So it was like their post-game handshake except it was pointing up to him in the hospital bed.

Jessica: Oh, wow…

Lindsay: That is just ... It's just that's what's good because it is just so ridiculous, it is just bringing me a lot of joy right now.

Brenda: Usually men being ridiculous makes us mad, but in this case, it makes us a little mad, but also, kind of funny.

Lindsay: I mean it's definitely burn pile worthy, but it's also hysterical.

Brenda: Jessica, what about you?

Jessica: Yeah, well Nashville's the top of my list. I'm so excited. As you heard earlier in the show, I'm just thrilled about the US Open and then I made a blueberry pie the other day. The crust didn't work out so well, I need to work on that, but it was such an amazing recipe because you cook the pie crust all the way and then you do a quarter of the blueberries on the stove top with the sugar and cornstarch and they break apart, and then you take them off the burner and you mix the rest of the blueberries in and then you pour that into the pie crust. Then you just leave it on the counter for a couple of hours and the cornstarch puts it all together.

So, many of the blueberries are just full blueberries. It is so good. So I'm going to have to make another one and work on my pie crust. It's a good excuse. So that was good over the last couple of days.

Brenda: Cool. Amira

Amira: Yeah, so Nashville, which, a little known fact is that is where I got my escape room start while I was doing research there many of years. I'm so excited to see all you guys. So there's that. School started for the kids and I'm having to report the first week went really well. Zachary loves preschool. Jackson is thriving in first grade, which is a plot twist we did not see coming, I just have to say.

And Mari loves middle school. I'm whispering in case she hears me because then she'll of course say it's not cool, but she gets off the bus every day like “that was the best day!” And her teacher is a black woman who's also a Patriots fan for her math and science class and she's just like, "I love math and science now."

Brenda: That's awesome.

Amira: So whatever you're doing Jocelyn Mitchell, keep doing it. And so it was a successful house. Oh, and Zachary's potty trained!

Brenda: Oh, wow.

Amira: So you know, I'm done with diapers. I'm done.

Jessica: Yay, that's very good.

Amira: No more, I'm done. No more pull ups. I'm just feeling like supermom-ish. Not really, I'm feeling like my baby's growing up and it makes me really sad, but I mean, and I have a new book out. I love The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo series and so Stieg Larsson died before his trilogy was published. But this dude David Lagercrantz has kind of run with the story. I don't like them as much, but I still think they're better than most books. And also I love the protagonists who are still the same. So that came out Tuesday. So I'm mostly just like laying around, listening to my book and pretending I can speak Swedish. So that's my what's good.

Brenda: I went all over Stockholm pretending I spoke Swedish. It was hilarious. It turns out the Midwestern “hej” is very useful. I am so super excited about Nashville. I don't have a cowboy hat and I don't want to let anyone down. So I will look at the airport. I promise if that's something people feel is important. I'm so excited to see all of you.

Also back to school is also, I mean it's mixed bag, but it is a good bag. I love going to school supply shopping. I hate going clothes shopping but I love going to school supply shopping. This year because they're all in higher grades, it's like more and more and more intense and expensive, but it's also awesome. So I got like, this is so funny. Okay, my kids got some really amazing binders but I do love school supply shopping. Shireen.

Shireen: I have a couple things. First and foremost, Nashville, I'm really excited like I said, to see my co-hosts, I love my co-hosts very much. I'm really excited about back to school in Canada, we start after Labor Day, so my kids’ first day will be on Tuesday. I did want to say this because I forgot last week, Jihad got her driver's license and this is really important because then I don't have to haul ass to take her to soccer all the time.

It's great, it's liberating, but it's also really like, I wasn't even ready, she got her license and then that night she's like, "Okay, I'm taking the car and going to practice," and I wasn't emotionally ready for that because how old is she? 17 ? For 12 years I've been shuttling her and then reminding her that I've been shuttling her to practice to give her that guilt, but now I can't do that anymore. So I'm sort of like, "Whoa, what do I threaten you with? I do this for you and you don't care!?” It's just, I don't know what to do!

Lindsay: You'll find something Shireen, I believe in you.

Shireen: Yes, I know. Thank you. The other thing that I've been doing is I've been binge watching Brooklyn Nine Nine in preparation for the conference because Terry Crews is actually the keynote speaker and I did not, I hadn't committed to watching the show and I'm absolutely loving this. My eldest son Saif was like, "Mama, you need to watch this show. You're like Gina, you'd really need to watch the show." But I didn't know that I would love it this much because you all know that I'm very committed to Law and Order and I didn't want Law and Order to feel like I was cheating.

Then Andre Braugher used to be in Homicide: Life On The Streets, which had crossovers and then it's all coming together. So Dick Wolf, I still respect your show, you know I'm your fan, but this is hilarious. Like I just, I'm having so much fun with this show, so I'm laughing a lot. Thank you to whoever's Netflix account I'm using.

Brenda: That's it for this week in Burn It All Down. Though we're done for now, we remind you, you can burn all day and all night with our fabulous array of merchandise. Also Burn It All Down, lives on SoundCloud, but can be found on iTunes, Spotify, Stitcher, Google Play and Tune In. We appreciate all your reviews and feedback and then except if they're bad, don't write anything. Just kidding.

Lindsay: She’s not kidding!

Brenda: Please do subscribe. I'm a little kidding. You can find us on Facebook and Instagram @burnitalldownpod and on twitter @burnitdownpod.

You can email us @burnitalldownpod@gmail.com. Check out our website, www.burnitalldownpod.com where you can find previous episodes, transcripts, and links to our Patreon. We would again, appreciate you subscribing, sharing, and rating our show. It does help us do the work that we love to do, and help us keep on burning what needs to be burned. I'm Brenda on behalf of the whole crew here, Amira Rose Davis, Shireen, Lindsay and Jessica: burn on, and not out.

Shelby Weldon