Interview: Diana Matheson, Canada Women's National Team Stalwart on the Future of a Canadian League

In this episode Shireen Ahmed interviews Canada Women's National Soccer Team stalwart Diana Matheson, who is responsible for the game-winning goal in stoppage time to clinch the bronze medal for Canada in the 2012 Olympics. They discuss Diana's journey into playing professionally, the building of the Canadian program, an overdue professional league, and if, in fact, history was made right at the 2020/21 Olympics. 

This episode was produced by Tressa Versteeg. Shelby Weldon is our social media and website specialist. Burn It All Down is part of the Blue Wire podcast network.

Transcript

Shireen: Flamethrowers, my friends, I’m so happy to be talking to Canadian women's national soccer team stalwart, literally the person responsible for our bronze medal in 2002 – her feet, rather – Diana Matheson, recently retired, had been with the Canadian women's program since 2003, professional player in the NWSL. She is a fan of peaches at the moment. Diana is, among other things, an incredible advocate. She was part of the first Canadian women's national team union, which is incredibly important, and an outspoken advocate of all things wonderful. Welcome, Diana. 

Diana: Hi Shireen! Thanks for having me. Hi, Burn It All Down crew. 

Shireen: She also hails from Oakville, Ontario, which is an important part of the conversation we'll get into later, because I live not too far from there, and she is revered and loved, as she should be, and the cardboard cut-out there was the most photographed cardboard cut-out in club history, and still remains that way.

Diana: I think it's gone now.

Shireen: It was, but I want to know where it is because I want it. So when COVID opens everything up again, I may try to go steal it. I hope nobody's listening to this.

Diana: You should reach out to the club. Maybe they know. It had a good run, though. I think it was up for about 12 years. So I can't complain.

Shireen: Yeah, I know, but I want, I want it in my house. Like, I want it by my desk. [laughs] So, how are you doing?

Diana: I'm good. I'm a bit tired, I’m a bit busy. I very wisely went straight from retirement into watching these incredible Olympics and doing a bit of media for them, all the while prepping for an EMBA course at the Smith school of business, which I just started last week. And the first two weeks are very intense and I'm not sure my brain's working, so this should be a good podcast. 

Shireen: It'll be fantastic. And I know that you're in grad school and that's amazing and very, very difficult because an MBA is no joke – and you have advocated also strongly, and I said in the intro for all things that are good, but what I mean by that is expanding women's soccer for a domestic league. Can you tell us a little bit about…Is this part of your journey to try to get that?

Diana: Yeah, absolutely. It is. Yes. I want to be in the future kind of on that side of the game, behind the scenes. I've never had the coaching bug bite me, but I would love to help build something in Canada, run something in Canada. So, absolutely. I knew I had to get a bit more business background in that, and then this opportunity at the Smith school of business, which is an incredible school, came about through Game Plan. So, the COC has kind of a helpful program for athletes heading towards retirement called Game Plan, and there's a few scholarships available through that. So I was very fortunate to get into the program that way. So, hats off to Game Plan and the COC for doing that, because that's a really good resource for athletes looking to do the next thing. It's super interesting to take these classes now, too, because everything I'm learning I can directly apply to, oh, we can use this for that. We can use this for that. [Shireen laughs] So it's perfect timing, really. And literally started the day after Canada won their gold medal. So, the timing was ridiculous. Like, I couldn't say no to the opportunity, and yeah, I'm very lucky that that fell into my lap. 

Shireen: I love that we're talking about this now, but I do want to back up a little bit and go back to your storied career, which is incredible. Part of my self care dossier is actually rewatching your goal in 2012, which is a very fraught Olympics for me personally – one of my traumas in sport was from a particular game, and you were there, you were actually there. So yes, I'm making this about me, because I was sad and mad for a long time. But Diana, when you started playing soccer, did you know always…I mean, when you played at elite levels, did you know that you had to keep contributing to the future? Is that something you actively thought of as a young player as you progressed?

Diana: No. I think that's something you get as you get older. I think when you're a young player you're excited to be there, and I think you say things like, oh, it's about leaving a legacy, but I don't think you get it as much as you get a bit older in your career and you see what's out there and you see the impact that you can have. So no, I didn't really think about any of that stuff. I've kind of just made it up as I've gone. [Shireen laughs] When I was first in high school, I didn't really dream of being in the Olympics. Like it wasn't, wasn't on TV yet for me to dream about, I wasn't on the national team yet. And then got on the national team and I was like, oh yeah, we could go to the Olympics. And then once we were going to Olympics, we were like, oh yeah, no, we can win a medal here! And so I think one of my strengths is just recognizing good opportunities when they're coming my way and just taking fully advantage of them when they happen. Not so much planning going on.

Shireen: I've written a lot about as an outsider, an observer of the way the team cohesion is, and I interviewed you and Janine Beckie last year for the contributions that you're making for the Conquer COVID-19 campaign. And Janine spoke about the culture of the team that the young ones come into, and you were part of really building that program. Was that there for you, that guidance, that leadership, that understanding, and quite frankly an anti-oppression sort of understanding of things – which we grow and we all unlearn. But was that there when you got to the team, to the national team?

Diana: I think probably the main shift in culture that made us put more thought and awareness into our culture came with John Herdman. His detailed approach put more intent behind everything we did, and that included our team culture. So for sure it solidified then to allow us to be more organized and stand up for more things and have our voices heard and solidified in a new way. So, probably the sea of that came with John; certainly before that there was strong voices on the national team that kind of led to, you know, my generation being who we are. We were certainly shaped by the strong women on the team before that. And we’re lucky in Canada, or national team is fairly diverse compared to other national teams in women's soccer, certainly. So I think that's a gift we have to, that we have a more diverse group of voices to begin with. 

Shireen: Absolutely. And I think people take that for granted, that the racialized makeup of the team isn't something…You're right. It's a gift, and it's something that offers perspective, and there's queer players, there's non-binary players, trans players, and I think that's really important as well. I think our team is a dream team, but I'm biased, very biased. Or am I though!? So, here's the thing. When you were growing up in Oakville, what was it like when you went to play in Division I in the NCAA? So was that like your only option, or did you consider other things, like, can I stay in Canada? Or like, what are possible routes that you had versus now? And what do you want to see more of?

Diana: Great question. I am less knowledgeable on the routes now. Certainly my route is probably outdated. And my journey was…I wasn't with any of the national team programs yet. I didn't make any of the youth national teams. So for that reason, I wasn't highly scouted into the US. At that time, it was definitely like if you wanted to continue to pursue soccer at a high level, the journey for us was definitely pushed down into the US and the NCAA. So I was looking for schools down there. But I applied to a few schools in Canada as well. I applied to Queens and got in, and if I didn't get into the school I wanted in the US that was kind of my plan. But I applied to a few schools in the US; I applied to Notre Dame and they said I could come and try out, but I think I had to pay my way if I went in there, so that wasn't an option for me and my parents. And then my parents would only let me go down to the US if it was a good school.

So I had known a couple of teammates with the provincial program who went down to Princeton a couple of years ahead of me. So, obviously knew it was a good school. I knew there's a couple of Canadians down there I knew. So yeah, I applied and got into Princeton. So I went down there for the soccer and the school. And in terms of the future, I think that ties into that pro league question, and hopefully in, you know, 5, 10 years, whatever the timeline is, we've already had a pro league, it's up and running…I think then we can see a future where our university players or high school players don't have to go down to the US as much. I think there can be pro environments in Canada that they're playing in while perhaps still pursuing education in universities in Canada. Because that's kinda how it works in the rest of the world, right? Like, when you're good enough, you make a pro team.

But nowhere else in the world has NCAA rules. [Shireen laughs] So, you might as well just play pro, get paid while learning. We can do all of those things. I think that would be great. And Canada has such top universities too. It's not like anyone staying in Canada would be hurting for a good education. So I think that that's one of the things a future pro league can hopefully impact as well. 

Shireen: So, why do you think we are where we are? We're like a top ranked top 10 team and had been for a very long time. Why is Canada in this situation? And it's not just soccer, it's basketball or hockey as well, and arguably we have the best athletes in the world in women's sports in these particular categories. Why are we here?

Diana: Yeah. I don't know all the answers for that. Certainly for soccer there's maybe something about it not…I mean, it's so much more deeply entwined of the cultures in other countries that it was kind of more natural decades ago that they had women's leagues and then eventually they became professional where we didn't have those deeper roots. But yeah, for hockey and other things, that's maybe not the same argument there. Yeah. I don't know. Canada doesn't do a lot of its own leagues. We go to the US for most of them, right? And we just add franchises to the US. It's not like we have a ton of independent sports leagues going on. So it is maybe a weakness nationally anyways, and then, yeah, no one's got around to building a successful women's league yet. So that's the exciting part.

I think it means there's also opportunities that we build from scratch and build in a way that no one has done before. And we can build with, you know, 20 years plus knowledge of women's sports, of lived experience in clubs and professional environments, and we can soak in all the knowledge we have across this country and build something really cool from scratch. So it could be actually a really unique and innovative experience, and we could end up with a league that’s built for the players and the fans in a way that no one else around the world has done yet. And that could be pretty cool.

Shireen: You heard it here first, flamethrowers, CEO D-Math, right here. I think that's really important and I love the part that you're talking about, intentionality, with which to build these type of structures, because there's so many problems within – whether it's toxic culture, whether it's problems, whether it's lack of transparency, financially. These are all really great things that I look forward to as well. So, you're a Princeton…And that's like such a gentle flex. If I went to Princeton, I'd probably wear a sign. So, yay.

Diana: [laughs] You asked me specifically about my journey through university. I feel like I had to!

Shireen: You have to! You absolutely have to. And it's an incredible accomplishment. But also, the journey with the team…And there was coaching changes just before, right? Like at pivotal moments, there was coaching changes, like very much like this particular iteration, John went to the men's side and Bev came on board. And that's not too soon before the Olympics, COVID-19 all withstanding, and the delay. So, what was that like to manage as a player with that coaching shift? What's that like from the inside?

Diana: Like when John came kind of that close timeline and then when Bev has come–

Shireen: –and in between as Kenneth Heiner-Møller took over, like, in pretty pivotal moments there was coaching changes. So, what's that like to navigate as a player?

Diana: Yeah. Kind of depends on the coach coming in and how much change that they're making. I think certainly since John, the core of the team has stayed pretty consistent. So I think we're able to keep the culture pretty similar throughout. And then the coach kind of just adds that in different ways, you know? In more tactical, less tactical, in louder, quieter ways. Like, whatever their personality is. But I think hopefully the team is at a point now where they're pretty self-determining to some degree too. I think it's a pretty mature group. I mean, those veteran players have been around the block forever now, and then that middle group has been around the block for tournaments now, like the Kadeishas and the Ashleys and the Quinnys and the Jessies – they’re medalists already, you know? And they're hungry for gold. So it's not like they’re too new either. So I think they're able to keep the culture pretty similar regardless of who the coach is.

Shireen: So as somebody who was integral in the development and the continuation of this program, when you saw the gold medal all win – and if people don't know, [Diana laughs] Canada won the Olympics in women's football, I'm just making sure– 

Diana: Do you think there’s anyone listening to your podcast who didn't know that?

Shireen: I just want to make sure they're really clear, Diana.

Diana: I don't think those are mutually exclusive. 

Shireen: [laughs] So, you've contributed to that. Did you get a sense of this incredible, “Yes, we did it!” when you were watching? Because you were watching from home in Toronto.

Diana: Oh, absolutely. Yes. [Shireen laughs] I feel like everyone that watched it…And then especially anyone who’s been at all invested in women's soccer over the last few years or decades, it was like, oh yeah, can you believe it? We did it. 

Shireen: But you actually are someone…Like, for me to say that is one thing. Diana, for you to actually say that is different, because you have contributed to these events and to the development of this team. And considering what happened in 2012 and wanting to…What was that like? Because if people also don't know, there was a reffing call in 2012 in the Olympics, the game against the United States, which was what I consider a completely unjust and most brutal call in the history of officiating in football, against Erin McLeod, that she held the ball for seven seconds, which changed the trajectory of the game. Do you think history was made right, Diana?

Diana: Oh, there was something so satisfying about it. [Shireen laughs] Yeah, no, it was such a cool…Canadians really identify with the women's soccer team, I think. And there's just something about the way the story is being written, eh? Like, the history of 2012, and people remember that game, and it hit them in the heart. And then the semifinal this time around and like a bit of retribution, and then on top of that, getting the gold? It was more than just the storyline of like, yeah, we won gold in the Olympics. It was like, oh, this has been comin’. And we followed them on their journey. Like, I think there's something about that. And the players too kept saying it, like, they were doing it for Sinc, they were doing it for the older players, like Desi and Soph and Erin, and they were doing it for the past players, like, oh, beautiful! Like, I feel like it just tied everyone in.

Can I ask you though…Because I'm obviously going to remember where I was when I watched this one, like, the events that you remember where you were in your life. So do you remember where you were for the US game or for the London game? 

Shireen: Absolutely. 

Diana: Where were you? 

Shireen: I was sitting in my parents' basement in their old house in Windsor, Ontario, and my children were with me because my children are huge Canadian women's team fans, and they could name the whole roster, they knew everybody. My daughter plays at the same club where Diana used to play, so obviously she's like the star for us, because familiarity. They knew. And we were sitting there in shock and my brother is actually a qualified referee and he was furious, and my family…There was rage, and it was palpable rage, and anger and emotion. And my kids were really…And I felt like they had just witnessed their first sporting injustice – and there will be many more, but that was the most pronounced one for me and my daughter in particular, because my daughter's a goalkeeper. And I think that was a learning moment for her because she's never held the ball longer than four seconds possibly ever because of that.

And then this time, I definitely know where I was when we won gold, but also for me, I was more anxious, I think, about the semi…No, I was anxious in the final, but the semi was also rough because it was kind of a fallback. And I am in a chat group with Meg Linehan, Steph Yang, and Sandra Herrera. And when US advanced, I remember thinking, wait a minute, are we playing the Americans? And I went, “Guys…” in the chat group, and nobody replied to me. I'm like, oh man! [Diana laughs] This is happening again. And I don't know if I was prepared for that. And how I could be like…When you talk about hit people in the heart, it hit big. And like I'm a sports journalist, and I think that when I gather with other colleagues, this is the moment we talk about a lot, that 2012 game.

Diana: Do you know what was really cool out of this Olympics too? I feel like there was so many videos of, you know, teammates of the Canadians in the NWSL or international players, like footage of them watching the gold medal game and just celebrating when Canada won, like how cool was that? Well, to be fair, everyone is probably like, okay, the US has won enough, let's give Canada a turn. [Shireen laughs] But also like, it's Sinc! It's Christine. Like, everyone in women's soccer just knows how good she is. Everyone was just so happy that Canada won for Sinc. 

Shireen: I wanted to ask you about that too, because even Americans, all my American friends were like, I mean, it's hard to hate the Swedes because they're so lovely generally. I mean, Hedvig Lindahl is this incredible person and a player. Like, we all know that. But I was getting congratulations and good luck from people I didn't expect to, who normally don't. So, you are somebody that's been with his program for a while. That US-Canada rivalry, it's not just in hockey, it's very much there in soccer, and these people ended up being your teammates also in NWSL. So what's that like?

Diana: I feel like it's shifted a bit, to be honest. Well, maybe I'm retired, so I have less of an edge now. [Shireen laughs] So you're taking this from a retired player’s lens, perhaps, but I feel like it's shifted, and it may be the same for the hockey as well, Canada and the US. It always means everything, it's do or die. We hate losing to them more than anyone else. We want to beat them more than anyone else. And I think 10, 15 years ago it was like full hatred, like, end of. Whereas I feel like women's sports is where it's at, where there's a little bit of, “we're all in the same boat” and “we're all fighting to move the needle.” And again, we play with half of them too, [Shireen laughs] so we know them as people. Yeah.

The work they've done on that side of the game and moving the conversation forward for women's sports, and then the backlash they get for that in the US, like…We play in the US, we're very lucky to be up here. We don't get…We probably get 10% of the BS they get thrown at them, and it's incredible. And they do such good work and they get so much hate for it too. So there's that layer of respect in there too, as a competitor and as people, that may be honestly probably wasn't there like 10, 15 years ago, because we weren't having those types of conversations as much. So yeah. It's like do or die against US. But if we end up in a bar fight with some of those players [Shireen laughs] against some people who aren't on the side of women's sports, we're fighting with the Americans any day.

Shireen: Oh, that was beautifully put. Your experience in the NWSL – and I am pretty sure you heard about the recent story that broke in the Washington Post about Richie Burke. You’ve been…You were at that club, like, that's part of your history too. What's that like, even though you're retired now, to see that and to be like, damn, because being at Washington is a part of your history with those American players that you know, that you talk about something else, unfortunately, that women's players and nonbinary players have to endure is this type of toxicity in sport. What was that like? 

Diana: Yeah. In my NWSL career I was with them, the Spirit, the longest. That was kind of my home team. I feel like I have this sense of this one, of, “Again?” Like, it was one of those reactions, I think, where I think a lot of the players are at that. “This is happening again?”

Like, are we not past this yet? We have to start building a better system of safe sport, whatever that looks like. I know we're working on that in Canada too; certainly the NWSL has to work on that. And the NWSL is starting to work closer with the NWSLPA, their players association. So I think a strong collaboration there will help, because you just have to start listening to the players more in all these things, and the players know it.

They know when things go wrong, they can see when something's ahead, or like, this has happened again and again and again, and you need that feedback and then you need to start putting the actual structures and systems in place so it doesn't keep happening. It's just too repetitive and too much of a pattern right now. And then I think there's something around transparency too, which I think the NWSL is battling with, that they're going to have to figure out. There's a lot of people there trying to improve things. So I think they just gotta sit down and get to work and change it, because I think the players are pretty sick of it down there.

Shireen: One of the things was in the reporting, Kaiya McCullough was the player that came forward, and she had said – and this is a quote from the piece that Molly Hensley-Clancy wrote – that Kaiya had said this particular incident and this person made her “hate soccer.” So when you hear that of a young player, how does that feel for you rather?

Diana: It didn't surprise me, to be honest. There's still coaches like that that exist. And I mean, how many jobs or industries do you work in where your employer or your boss, sorry, is allowed to treat you that way? And that still exists in sports. I mean, it's the same for any other job. People feel they perform best in situations where they feel valued, they feel psychologically safe, they're challenged and they are treated like people. That's true in any industry and that's true in sports. And unfortunately there's still coaches out there who haven't caught up to that yet and aren't treating players that way. And I think there needs to be changes in hiring processes and vetting some of the people getting into sports, certainly, because it's not like a lot of the people who are in these incidents, it's their first job, right? Like, they've all been around a while. And I think that goes back to, are you actually talking to the players? Because I think probably if you talk to these players in past environments with these coaches, they're all gonna say the same thing. It's just that you haven't asked them or you haven't listened. You got to start improving that.

Shireen: I think that's really important, and well noted. 

Diana: Can I say too? The Spirit has been really cool to watch though, because the changes they've made in the last few years, like a better stadium, more professional…The owners there are doing a good job. So hopefully they correct this and keep the team on track.

Shireen: Yeah, definitely. So, to lighten a little bit, because we like to do that after we do heavy stuff at Burn It All Down, we like to lighten it with fun stuff. In your career, were you ever starstruck when you played against somebody? And if you were, who was that?

Diana: Yeah. Off the bat, in 2003, Mia Hamm was still playing! [Shireen laughs] And like, there was still like half the 99ers were on that team. So anyone from that, yes, absolutely starstruck from that. And the internet was in a very different state in that time. No social media, obviously. So after the games, I would go online and I'd try and find any of the game pictures and just save them. Like, that was the only way I could find to game pics. And there was a few with me and Mia Hamm.

Shireen: Ohh!

Diana: Yeah. I still have them on my computer.

Shireen: Do you get recognized and stopped when you’re out and when you're home? Do people see you and are like, oh my gosh, it’s Diana Matheson! Or is that just me?

Diana: Yeah, not too much. Like in soccer circles – so, you – [Shireen laughs] or in Oakville soccer circles specifically – again, you – after 2012, hugely, and then yeah, that changing sometimes. Do you know who gets recognized all the time, because I was hanging out with her during the Olympics, is Karina LeBlanc. Like in terms of recognizability, it's Sinc is way, way at the top. And then there's like a drop, but then there's Karina, and then there's a big drop, and then there's the rest of us. People recognize her all the time. They love Karina. 

Shireen: Yeah but Karina is also in sports broadcasting. So that makes sense. She does a lot of the–

Diana: So am I, Shireen! So am I!

Shireen: Yeah, well, you are too. Oh, by the way, I do have to say this, because for the 2019 Women's World Cup, Diana, you were injured at that time. Your all-women’s group with Clare Rustad, with Kaylyn Kyle, and with Kate Beirness on TSN – yes, shameless plug – was absolutely fantastic, and it was probably one of the best analytical commentators and punditry that I've ever seen in football. And I watch a lot of it. So I do want to say that.

Diana: Yeah, no, we had fun. We legitimately had fun. I really enjoyed it.

Shireen: But it was useful commentary and I thought it was very important for people to listen to, and it was very much needed. So I hope to see much more of that, but also if you want me to do your PR, I can, if that's what you're saying. Because that's what I'm hearing you say you want me to be like–

Diana: Is that…What did I say that made you hear that? [Shireen laughs] I'm just trying to listen back… Yeah, sure. You're in.

Shireen: But one of the really interesting things about this…And Sinky does not want the attention, so it's really interesting that she's one of the most recognizable, because she's the one–

Diana: Can I tell you one story…So, after 2012, I think beginning of 2013, myself, Rhian, Sinc, Karina, were like, oh, we got to capitalize on this a bit. We don't make a ton of money. So we went and we formed a company called iS4 and we did some camps and we were in Halifax doing a camp and we were getting into the minivan, like, the guy took us out to a restaurant or something, and Sinc was inside the minivan in the back window, and a woman was walking by on the street, and she saw Sinc, like kind out of the corner of her eye, turned her head. And then she did like the biggest double-take I've ever seen in my life. It was like a cartoon character. I think that women had whiplash from seeing Christine Sinclair. [Shireen laughs] And I always remember that. It was crazy.

Shireen: But it's really interesting that she really ended up watching and covering this team for so long. Doesn't love the pressers! She does it because she has to, you know? Doesn't want to make it about her, is always talking about the team. And we're like, you're literally the highest goal-scorer internationally of all time, of any soccer player, ever. No, it's about the team. Like, it's just really interesting. Has that remained consistent of her since the beginning, since you've known her?

Diana: Yeah, she doesn't love the limelight. She doesn't have much interest in it, I think. She knows the role she plays and that she has to do some of it and that she's she's the face. And she knows that. And she shoulders a lot of that. She's shouldered a lot of attention over her career. Like, she's been the interviews, the face of Canada for 15 years, and the pressure and all that. But no, Sinky is not too affected by it. She's feel so down to earth, humble, and still not much interest in getting her face in front of large groups of people.

Shireen: So, insider spoiler, maybe not spoiler: her handing off that pen to Jessie Fleming is a veritable passing of the torch. Can we make that assumption?

Diana: It was seemed symbolic. I think there was some circumstance around that penalty that had her give it to someone else, but yeah, that worked well didn’t it?

Shireen: [laughs] I was quite happy with that decision, personally. I mean, just that, but it was also Canadian sportswriters really reading into things, because we tend to do, but I think there was something beautiful about that. What was your favorite moment of the Olympics?

Diana: Oh, that's a good question. I don't know. It was a bit like London where I kind of liked the whole journey, which is cliche. Like when we do well in big tournaments it's got a storyline, and the first few games we were pretty good, but we gave up late game goals, which I think then served us well later in the tournament because we learned from it. I mean, the Brazilian game, I think you could see the team had shifted and they were in a good place. And coming out of the Brazilian PKs, you felt like we had a bit of invincibility to us. And then of course the US game. [Shireen laughs] I mean, the second half was a bit poor, wasn't it? But it was fine. 

Shireen: It wasn't the greatest soccer I've ever seen! But I'll take it. [laughs]

Diana: Yeah. And we nailed that game, obviously. I mean, the gold medal game was probably just mostly stressful. But yeah, the moments at the end. And the people taking and making penalties, like Deanne Rose going upper 90, like, yeah. Julia Grosso, Olympic gold medal PK. 

Shireen: But you know what that's like.

Diana: Who would have scripted that at the beginning of the Olympics, right? Oh, it was fantastic.

Shireen: I just got goosebumps. But you're somebody that knows what that's like. It was because of you that we got the bronze in 2012. You know what that's like. You know that these moments…It’s just that your perspective is so authentic here, and it's very relevant. If you could pick a team of retired players that you've played with, who is your top three choices?

Diana: Three?

Shireen: Yeah, like your dream team. 

Diana: Can I do a whole team? 

Shireen: Yes, please. I didn't want to ask for like 11 including you, but like…

Diana: I don't want to offend anyone though. Okay. [Shireen laughs] We’re spoiled for choices, aren’t we? Okay. We're going to go Karina, and because I want people paying attention to my team and people recognize her, but I got Taryn Swiatek as my backup. Okay. CBs, we're going to go Candace Chapman and Randee Hermus – Randee Hermus, like one of the most solid CBs to play for Canada. We're going to go Rhian Wilkinson fullback. I'm going to forget a ton of people.

Shireen: But I meant globally retired. Any players–

Diana: No, I’m going to stick to Canadians. I’ve already started.

Shireen: Okay, good.

Diana: Isabelle Morneau is going to be my other fullback. In the midfield we're going to go…I’ll play.

Shireen: Yes. 

Diana: And we'll go me, Amy Walsh, because like, skilled player, but also hard nose, gets the tackles in. And then Kristina Kiss, she's going to be our distributor pinging the balls. 

Shireen: Playmaker. Yeah.

Diana: I liked playing with Kristina Kiss when I first made the team. And then upfront we'll go Melissa Tancredi and Charmaine Hooper. And we'll go Silvana Burtini. Done. That's the starting 11 for my retirement team.

Shireen: That was fast and amazing. I love this question, and I'm so happy that you answered it–

Diana: I answered a totally different question than you asked me! [laughs] You're welcome.

Shireen: It's fine. I love this also. So if you could play with one player that you never got a chance to across the world in the women’s game, who would you really want to play with that you didn't get a chance to?

Diana: Oh, you know what? I would have loved to play…And I'm going to answer with more than one player again. I would've loved to play in Seattle. The year I was traded to Seattle I tore my ACL like three weeks after Laura Harvey signed me. So I missed the whole year. And then the team moved to Utah the year after. And that team…Well, Kim Little had just left. So I would have loved to play with Kim Little. But then that team had Jess Fishlock, it had Megan Rapinoe – there were some great players on the team I would have really enjoyed playing with had I had the chance to play that season. 

Shireen: Awesome. Friends, you had it right here. As we know her, future CEO, D-Math, we love her. Canada owes her an incredible debt of gratitude. And if anyone at the mint is listening, I would love to see her on some currency. So if that can happen as well, would appreciate that. Diana, we love you. I speak for the whole team and the whole world to say, thank you for coming on the show. I'm so excited to continue this excitement. And I promised my co-hosts I would be as insufferable about our win as possible. Thank you for joining me on that journey. 

Diana: Yeah, no, thanks for having me. You're just saying all those things because you're my PR person.

Shireen: [laughs] Quite possibly. See, I love that it's working already. And last thing: after the game in 2012 when you won, what was the song that you were listening to, to celebrate to? That squad? 

Diana: Oh, we for sure had Celine Dion on when we got back in, yeah.

Shireen: [laughs] I heard a rumor, but I just wanted you to confirm.

Diana: Yeah, absolutely. And I think it was later, like it was maybe 40 minutes later by the time everyone got drug tested and back in. And I think even like the Canada Soccer higher-ups were in and like belting it out too, was great. 

Shireen: Was that My Heart Will Go On?

Diana: No, Power Of Love. 

Shireen: Power Of Love. Of course. Amazing. Thank you for that, and for answering all the hard-hitting journalistic questions I had today, and you are welcome here anytime. 

Diana: Thanks for having me.